VIDEO; MAY 5th OTA

[neveroutwrenched]

[Time for another rousing round of Get Off the Network, Ratchet. At least this time he isn't drunk posting, although he is in the bar. It's just convenient. His tone is relatively cheerful but he is very, very serious. Something is going wrong on this ship.]

Okay, soooo, are we all gonna talk about how broken the justice system on this ship is now? How it doesn't work?

Because I feel like this is a great time. What with, people taking matters into their own hands, and all that.

Comments

[deal]

Do you have a suggestion?

[neveroutwrenched]

Actual consequences for murder would be a good place to start. People don't get time out, and a week of no ice-cream for killing people where I'm from.

video.

[t65]

[Luke knows, deep in his heart, that Leia is the better person to answer this, but.]

Well, we already are, now. [With a grin.] What do you think is broken about it?

[neveroutwrenched]

[Ratchet does his best to keep the surprise off his face. He knew Luke was on the ship, but hadn't actually seen him yet. Not the Luke he'd known, but so close it hardly mattered. It's jarring.]

It's...have you seen the network? They're at each other's throats.

We let people commit murder and then throw them back in with the rest of the crew a week later, free to do it again. People are scared...for themselves, or others, it doesn't matter. Scared people do dumb shit, but in this case...I can't blame them.

text; anon

[skelepun]

[Replying to this is probably a bad idea, considering, but hey. Why not poke at the bear. That's what the ""anon"" is for.]

you seem pretty upset about it.

[neveroutwrenched]

[Ratchet stares down at his MID, frowning. If Sans was trying to hide his identity he was doing a pretty poor job of it.]

im not UPSET.

[quixotically]

You know... yeah. Yeah. This is a really good time. Before anybody else gets hurt like this, again.

[neveroutwrenched]

That's what I mean....we can't just keep putting this off and pretending it works.

text

[camouflage]

Your only other options are execution/imprisonment for the rest of the trip. Most of the ship doesn't seem to have the balls for either.

[neveroutwrenched]

I'm not sure I'm bothered by imprisonment being a consequence of murder. [He's a little more tentative about execution.] Isn't that how most people do things back home? I'm not saying we forgo a trial or anything like that, but...I don't know. It's not even on the table the way things are right now.

Text;

[devilofohara]

Where I come from, it's the Captain's job to keep the crew from fighting.

[Just throwing that out there.]

[neveroutwrenched]

Yeah. And they're doing a real good job, huh?

video;

[hatesimprovising]

[ Wash can't keep himself from chiming in because he's Very Opinionated about this situation. It's a little more complicated than simply a matter of justice... ]

I'd agree with you to an extent. We do need a justice system that actually works, but there's a limit to the types of punishments that are okay.

video;

[neveroutwrenched]

Yeah, I mean, what's going on now is probably a good example of punishments that are not okay.

[Although even that was a subject of debate; a problem in its own right.]

I guess that's....something we need to talk about. Decide as a group.

voice;

[rraidergirl]

A trial by one's peers is pretty wide spread where I'm from, but I agree. A week or so tops for murder is incredibly lenient.

[ Which really is why Lara's been abstaining entierly. ]

[neveroutwrenched]

It seems like that's the one thing everyone agrees on....it's not enough. Not for anyone to learn a lesson, or to make anyone feel safe.

I guess that leaves us with the question of what is enough?

[And then maybe...what's too much.]

[vengeance_driven]

I don't think there will be any fixing it.

Shit opinion, but that's how I see it. See, normally I would see where Peter is coming from. But... look at what we used to be. Because we had to be. No choice in the matter. What if that had been done to us and our entire planet depended on it?

Or what if one of the gangsters who killed my girlfriend showed up, and I killed him. What if someone we know to be unstoppable and psychotic comes through?

It's a very tough matter to face, and because of this, I have not felt comfortable participating in it. It's a shame. But in the absence of it working, we really must work on arbitration.

[neveroutwrenched]

How are we supposed to arbitrate murder without justice?

[ersatzeverything]

Yup, sure is broken.

[There's Deacon's useful contribution.]

[neveroutwrenched]

It's super, mega broken.

[Ratchet's very helpful agreement.]

[keelahselai]

It doesn't work. I don't know if there's a system that can work without... [Without starting to go towards CDC levels of control and punishment. They all know how well that goes.]

I come from a flotilla of ships and there's a justice system and it works - but nobody on the fleet was kidnapped to be there. Nobody on the fleet comes back for revenge when they're murdered. [She twists her face sardonically.] People don't tend to kill each other this much on the fleet.

[neveroutwrenched]

People have to care.

[Ratchet follows her first point though. He doesn't want to see them go anywhere near the direction of the CDC. They need order, not control. Consequences not ultimatums.]

Maybe it's not possible to have a bunch of people on a ship like this and not fight. Not when they have nothing in common. [It wasn't hard to see how rapidly the 'us versus them' mentalities were taking root.] I don't want to think there's no way we can all get along but....damn. The way things are right now?

[needsnoface]

Taking into consideration various times periods, cultures, circumstances and prejudiced views that are intermingling upon this ship. A general system would hardly work, but the chance of someone making a system that compromises and outlines things in a clear manner that all would follow is also unlikely due to someone ready and willing to say it's too lenient or too harsh.

Add in that our 'esteemed' captains have a very hands off approach in keeping this crew in any order...well short of a hostile takeover in regards to the judicial system and some form of martial law we'll just talk ourselves into circles. Or those who with more extreme views get their way and silence those of us seen as lesser or too dangerous to remain unchained that is.

After all, if we're to talk of justice one should also take into account various lifestyles and differing planets. What if one who has known war all their lives were triggered into reacting violently and mercilessly because someone unknowingly tripped them during a spat or scuffle? Should they be treated the same way as someone who deliberately set up a confrontation with another in hopes of killing them? Should those emotionally invested in the outcome of a specific person even be allowed to judge or bring evidence that is likely biased and slanted towards their view of things?


In a way, it is less the system we should be talking about first, but in setting up a power base and structure that then creates a system. Wouldn't do any of us any good to create a system that is then thrown away because we do not have the authority or power to make the ship as a whole follow it.

[neveroutwrenched]

Uh...I don't know.

[Power base is not a term that sits well with him, and Ratchet hesitates, chewing over what BB said.]

The last ship I was on the captains had complete judicial control. Their authority was supreme but it...it wasn't good. I think what you're saying [and there was a lot] has merit, but I don't know if I believe that authority is the only way to make something work.

[At least he really hoped not.]

video

[diamondslap]

[LOOK AT THIS SHIT EATING GRIN, RATCHET. LOOK AT IT.]

To the surprise of no-one...

Re: video

[neveroutwrenched]

[Oh he sees it.]

So I guess we should all pat ourselves on the back for seeing it coming, huh?

[voice]

[inruins]

One would think given how widespread complaints are regarding this system there would be some change to it by now. Have we gotten any comments from the Captains yet or has it purely been radio silence?

[neveroutwrenched]

Nothing.

Although.....I guess if we're being fair, I don't know if anyone's contacted them directly.

[Voice]

[dragonspride]

So whose definition of "crime" do you propose we use?

And who do you think should be stepping forward saying they know what 'really' happened?

[neveroutwrenched]

The people who get hurt, that's whose. Those are the people who's definition matters.

text.

[prayed]

They can just slap a bandaid on 'em and call it fixed right now.

A few deaths is no big deal to them, so nothing's gonna change.

It's not like our lives really matter to them, anyway.

[neveroutwrenched]

okay im not saying i dont agree with you


damn, thats bleak

[video]

[mttbrandlegs]

The judicial system of any place cannot be relied upon to correct the issues between people, just judge them. It's sort of in the name!

[Mettaton isn't arguing, so much a pointing something out. He'd not participated in the proceedings for the last incident because he didn't feel like weighing in to something that didn't concern him.]

That being said...the sentencing could use some work!

[neveroutwrenched]

Uh...well. Yeah I mean, I guess that's true.

[A least sort of.]

But if problems aren't gonna be solved, we need to be doing something to keep this stuff from happening again and again...

[And boy does it keep happening]

VIDEO

[squadgoals]

Has anyone reached out to the captains with all of these concerns? If they're the ones who put it in place, it's worth sitting down with them for a discussion, before anyone else happens.

[neveroutwrenched]

So, what, you're just gonna come in here and get logic all over my pissed off parade?

[He's joking, but the deadpan sarcasm almost hides it completely. She's right of course, and a surge of common sense isn't really a bad thing.]

But uhm...yeah. You're probably right. Although it doesn't really right what's already happened. With Rinzler.

text;

[peridork]

[Peridot has been reluctant to weigh in on all of this, but...]

Where I come from, Gems are shattered on a regular basis for far less. However, judging by the responses you've already received on this little rant of yours, I'm guessing annihilation of the offending party isn't an option that would be very well received among the rest of the crew.

[She is no longer sure if that's a good or a bad thing.]

I feel that what we need is some longer term punishment that doesn't necessarily require incarceration. This is a crew, and we need everyone on board to be contributing to the function and progress of the ship. The conclusion that I have reached is that offenders should be equipped with some kind of device or modification to their MID. Something that will help keep a closer eye on them, and deter them from a repeat offense while also warning the rest of the crew of their status as a dangerous individual.

Re: text;

[neveroutwrenched]

That sounds dangerously like what they're doing to Rinzler...which is exactly what we don't need.

[There's a pause before he sends another message.]

I'm not saying it's a terrible idea but...thinking of the crew as resources is...maybe not the best starting point.